Ahh Nicaragua

[MizBrown]

Ismael came to me the other day with something that kinda surprised me. He said, what about I join the military in the USA, they will take foreigners. Not my first choice but I said let me check it out. I have a few friend that are career military guys so I am about to ask them about it.

Just speculation, but I think what the kid has in mind is to find something where he can send all his $$ back home.

The money is a consideration, so that makes the military option a decent one -- and he gets US citizenship and the watered down GI bill. My way earlier suggestion is still real -- the really upscale universities like Harvard tend to have had students from very non-traditional backgrounds (two Masai students from the veldt went to Harvard). A state college tends not to have that sort of infrastructure or experience with very non-traditional students (and tend to be committed to flunking out a certain chunk of their students).

Got to be his decision -- one of the Masai kids who went to Harvard didn't actually apply but told them when he came to give a presentation that he was going to be enrolling. They made it happen for him. Other kid has government money from Kenya, if I remember the details. I'd recommend against Columbia, even though it's my alma mater -- NYC is just too distracting.

If he wants to send money home, that's sort of that. The next trick is getting him to do something better than the typical two year school who scam for the GI bill funds. MIT would be an option -- post a military experience, he could probably manage NYC -- Columbia has a good engineering school.

[cookshow]

The Military idea kinda floored me, I did not see that coming.. MizBrown is right, these big name schools are hungry for Ismaels.

When he graduates in December he will only be 16, so it would be a year before he could enlist. My best friend is a career Military guy and he is going to check on all the actual logistics.

The more time I've had to think about it the more it makes some sense, even an enlisted man's low pay is a fortune here.

Far as the citizenship I don't think he is too interested in it, of course once he has a taste that may change. Talking to him I just have not seen him get excited about the options in the States, that is why I was shocked when me came to me with the military idea.

[cookshow]

Do they vote?

There is a lot of crazy shit here, unless you have family of very close friends you never see it. I know someone who has been trying to get a Cedula for 7-8 years, every election time they come and look her (my guess is they have a list with those in here shoes), have her fill out some paperwork and promise her a Cedula, a few days before the elections they show up with a piece of paper allowing her to vote, but no Cedula..... Seen it over and over. No idea what the motive is behind it all.

[Jonh]

No cedula, no INSS, she doesn't exist except at election time and she can't officially complain.

[RGV AG]

From what I understand in order to be accepted or admitted to the military a foreign national has to already be in the US under some immigration status. I believe it was much easier when Uncle Sam was jonesing for bodies back in the early 00's. In the last few years I have heard a couple of first hand stories of kids trying to enlist but that were not on a resident alien status or whatever and they were turned down. I know some locals tried to enlist and such at the US embassy and were also turned away. But who knows, maybe there is a way. The military is a great way to go for folks that want to acquire citizenship or even just galvanized resident alien status with good bennies.

I hope something good breaks for the young man. An educational experience in a competitive and challenging environment does wonders for people that come from societies like Nicaragua.

[Little Corn Tom]

I hope something good breaks for the young man. An educational experience in a competitive and challenging environment does wonders for people that come from societies like Nicaragua.

The US could use more kids like him.

[cookshow]

From what I understand in order to be accepted or admitted to the military a foreign national has to already be in the US under some immigration status.

That was my initial thought. My buddy is going to visit with a recruiter this week and see what is what.

[Little Corn Tom]

From another forum:



Enlistment into the U.S. Marine Corps, or any branch of the U.S. military, by citizens of countries other than the United States is limited to those foreign nationals who are legally residing in the United States and possess an Immigration and Naturalization Service Alien Registration Card (INS Form I-151/551 — commonly known as a "Green Card"). Applicants must be between 17 and 35; meet the mental, moral, and physical standards for enlistment; and must speak, read and write English fluently.


Note: The U.S. military branches cannot assist foreign nationals in obtaining admittance into the United States. Questions concerning immigration to the United States should be asked of the U.S. Embassy. Only after immigration procedures are completed and an applicant is legally residing in the United States may an application for enlistment be accepted.

Furthermore, in order to be commissioned an officer in the U.S. Navy, one must be a native-born or naturalized United States citizen.

The U.S. government agency which is responsible for immigration and naturalization is the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Service. Their web site is at http://uscis.gov/graphics/index.htm

[cookshow]

Should know more in the next day or so, my buddy is checking on it and if he told me to jump I would ask how high, so what he tells me I take as gospel.

[chhealey]

Here's another option...If he got into a college he could go the ROTC route. ROTC offers scholarships with stipends. Having a student visa gives you a green card.Then he comes out an officer and only has to give 4 years of service.

[thom]

Vets that I respect strongly endorsed the army route. You are guaranteed the training you want (electronics/heavy diesel/instrumentation) if
you pass the aptitude test. 3 years later you come out a disciplined well trained person who has seen some of the world.Also was told of army matching funds sent
back to family. Then, with maturity and money can go to university with government assistance. Added bonus is US citizenship.

[thom]

Going to the states to college in the early 70's did not give me a green card or draft status.
Only work I could do was on campus based on financial need.

[Gringo Canuck]

Yes a student visa, will NOT normally give one a green card.................http://travel.state.gov/content/visa...e/student.html

[cookshow]

Only work I could do was on campus based on financial need.

I was wondering about that and kinda figured that he would only be able to have that sort of work.

[Mas]

Still trying to figure out what the point of it all is, anyway? "Send in the Clowns"?

[Outstanding in the Dirt]

Still trying to figure out what the point of it all is, anyway? "Send in the Clowns"?

The answer is in the early posts of this thread.

[MizBrown]

Maybe let him grow up a little in the military, and then try to get him into a good college later after he's had more exposure to the world. I suspect that a frugal kid who lives on base, doesn't drink, and who doesn't have a car could send a quarter to half of his pay back home and $200 to $500 a month would make a difference to his family.

Read the replies that had more information. I don't think the US military route sounds all that feasible after seeing those comments. The colleges with huge endowments have the money for full rides -- one person I knew in NYC who'd been on a full scholarship with expenses said that it was wonderful being the poor girl at a rich girls' school. She got a free vacation in Europe.

[cookshow]

I think, that is what he is looiking at.

[MizBrown]

That makes him a very good kid as well as a smart kid, but if the military only works for green card holders, it's time for Plan B.

[cookshow]

His Military idea does seem like a long shot from what I am learning but maybe not impossible, still waiting to hear from an actual expert, that word should come soon. Kinda figured Ismael would be by today, we have some seeds to sort through and figure out what to do with, will see what new ideas he has for me now, the Military idea took me by surprise.

School is supposed to start back up soon, I believe the middle of the month.

[cookshow]

I guess if all the recent news reports are true (return of the draft), Ismael may get a chance to be in the Military, just not the way he imagined it.

[RGV AG]

Population in Nicaragua is much larger and much more diverse than it was in the late 70's and 80's. I would love to see some of the young men that I have had to deal with here in Nicaragua get drafted into any type of military, they would wreck it. The social dysfunction wrought by the 80's here has created a whole segment of population here that is basically just shy of total dysfunction, to try and incorporate that type of population into the military would be macabre version of a baggy pant, tatted up, drug seeking Sgt. Bilko and the Nica's aren't prepared for that.

The Nicaraguan military has stayed fairly respectable and professional, all things considered, due to it being selective and small. Making it large will turn it into nothing more than an olive clad Oriental Market. Good luck to them.

[Little Corn Tom]

And just how is this different from the US?

[Just Plain John Wayne]

And just how is this different from the US?

I have not spent any amount of time lately in the US, but from what I see on this side of the screen it is not like what RPG describes at all...

[RGV AG]

And just how is this different from the US?

Well let me quantify that the bulk of my experience in Nicaragua has been in and around Managua, but that is where about 60% of the population does live. Given that I would assume if they did re-institute a draft, and I have heard nothing of the sort, that is where a bulk of the draftees would come from given the population and the fact that they are likely registered somewhere and somehow. As with most things Latin American, and as it was in the 80's I am told, there is a portion of the privileged population that would be able to dodge the draft. Only those with few means would be victim.

Given that in my opinion the draftees would not be of very high caliber at all, most with little or any education. Additionally many would come out of very dysfunctional environments. Folks don't realize that there are folks in Nicaragua that earn the minimum wage or just above it and will use that to buy piedra or other drugs, not to mention Ron Plata. When someone who makes $180 or so a month can afford crack that tells you of the dangers to the population.

Tom, just in percentage numbers of segments of the population there is vastly more middle or lower middle class American youths compared to Nicaraguan youths, on a per capita basis. That in and of itself would dictate that if the US implemented a draft their would be vastly more numbers of theoretically "decent" draftees. That is not to say they may not be soft of video game addicted, but they would have a much more formal education and also have a more traditional and stable background.

A bunch of guys I went to college with ended being career military and in speaking to them they all are extremely impressed by today's volunteer US serviceman. To a one they have oft repeated that while they may be a little physically soft, nothing training doesn't solve, they are much more educated and technologically savvy than in the past. Today's top flight military's are not populated by Sgt. Rock, but by geeks and that is just the reality of the situation.