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Thread: Vaccine

  1. #201
    Viejo del Foro el duende grande's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vaccine

    That's the legal problem the US has in employers, school's etc forcing a trial vaccine on people including minors. Although the vaccine manufacturers are exempt from lawsuits, I doubt employers and schools will be. That is why the politicians at CDC are pushing getting the vaccines legally approved even though they are years away from scientific proof. At least the Philippines are looking at criminal prosecution, the AZ VA was allowed to slide by firing 3 people. I wonder where they are working now, CDC maybe?

    I think the smart ones are going to offer employees a choice: shot or protocols including weekly testing to CYA the company. If the FL govs no-mask order ends poorly, he may very well end up in Cuomo Territory.

    I was given a health questionnaire and interviewed by what seemed to be a competent (private sector) health professional. Glad as hell I wasn't still going to the Dr. Mengele Arizona VA. But push come to shove, a some point a decision has to be made with the info on hand and a hip-shooting risk vs reward analysis. I did require that they show me the vial that the shot come from to see I was getting the right shot.

    Same deal on d3 shortage-- live in the tropics and tested in a sub-tropical desert and still came up short. I think it is an aging problem. Anyway 2 years ago I tested well and my prescription was dropped but I kept taking 2000units plus k2 3x per week and tested in the middle of the happy zone this year. Looks like a permanent thing with no known downside risk.
    Last edited by el duende grande; 08-12-2021 at 08:58 AM.

    "Support mental health or I'll break your head"

    Covid was an intelligence test and we flunked.



  2. #202
    TRN Science officer bill_bly_ca's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vaccine

    The pundits are starting to declare wave 4 starting now in On-scare-e-o

    Below is the current stats.

    Interesting how ICUs are habituated by vaccinated only. But these numbers lag daily counts by 2 weeks typically.

    We had 340 some infections recorded Sunday - 580+ yesterday... (Phat phingered that fixed)

    Will see how the 30ish percent who have yet to be completely vaccinated fare.

    This is our daily counter.. Counter

    The Feds jumped into the "International travel vaccination passport band wagon" yesterday.

    Teachers and other essential workers in Ontario still have no rumblings of mandatory vaccinations from the provincial Gov.
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  3. #203
    Para aquí para acá Jonh's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vaccine

    We need El Doc to come back here and give us his wisdom on Covid.

    Ok, maybe not.

  4. #204

    Default Re: Vaccine

    Quote Originally Posted by Jonh View Post
    We need El Doc to come back here and give us his wisdom on Covid.

    Ok, maybe not.




    His advice would probably be as good as anyone's.
    Actually, it would be kind of interesting to hear what El Doc had to say.

    Remember, five years ago we were told that without any possible doubt that Trump colluded with Russia.

    Thirty five years ago women couldn't run long distances, Olympics included.
    Their physiology wouldn't withstand it. Reproductive organs would be damaged.

    The list is endless.

    But,, telling the truth doesn't necessarily get you where you want to be.
    Galileo comes immediately to mind . . . . but there were many others.

  5. #205
    Para aquí para acá Jonh's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vaccine


  6. #206
    Para aquí para acá Jonh's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vaccine

    Who remembers thalidomide?

  7. #207
    TRN Science officer bill_bly_ca's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vaccine

    We were trending up with a reproduction rate of 1.5 / 1.6 about a week ago

    this week that has dropped to 1.2 / 1.25

    Not below 1, which is what is required for infection rates as a whole to decrease.

    Some public health officials are worried that with the high vaccination rate those who are infected have such mild systems they do not seek testing which could result in a misleading metric.

    Less than a 1/4 of those in hospital are vaccinated.

    On the passport front - The premier (like a US Governor) is steadfast about not issuing vaccine passports unlike the next two most populous provinces. But Public health offices for specific regions do have the power to do so and are collaborating amongst themselves on a workable schema - Toronto public health being in the forefront..

    Surprisingly, or not so, it has not been too big of an issue in the national election - Surprisingly in that it is easy low hanging fruit (according t polls) an not so surprisingly in that public health is a provincial responsibility and federal parties pontificating on public health issues usually make problems with the provinces.
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  8. #208

    Default Re: Vaccine

    Still seems like a high number.
    I saw something like that from LA county,, 25% of new covid cases are appearing in vaccinated.

    It would seem that we would want to fight this on all fronts.
    It has the potential to mutate to something really ugly if it's not stopped.

    While we have state medical boards in the US threatening to discipline doctors for using novel treatments like ivermectin (which they see working), the Australians are finding that ivermectin does indeed work.

    https://www.bing.com/search?q=australia+antiviral+research&FORM=AWRE



    One of the big benefits of living in Nicaragua is access to modalities of treatment not available in the US.

    I recently suffered a staph infection, tree branch scraped my neck, broke the skin. I brushed it with my hand, not thinking. Staph is everywhere here. These things can be nasty, you see kids with them all the time. They are highly contagious once the sores develop.

    Easy access to the preferred antibiotic, cephalexin, meant I could immediately address the infection. I am not discounting the knowledge and specialized training of doctors, quite the contrary. But much of this is NOT rocket science.

    My father died of sepsis from a staph infection. In a VA hospital in Reno. Over a weekend. He kept telling the doctor on duty, a Korean woman who didn't speak English well, that there was something wrong. She didn't want to call anyone on the weekend.

    He finally called my sister who immediately flew over from Palo Alto. She arrived as they were intubating him. At least she got to say goodbye.

    They kept him alive for three days,, he looked really good with the oxygen and kidney failure. Kidney failure meant he retained fluid and all his wrinkles disappeared. It was hard to believe that he was dead.

    But,, his major organs were jello, and he had some 20% of heart function left.
    The decision to pull the plug wasn't a hard one to make.


    In this pandemic,,

    God Helps Those Who Help Themselves
    Last edited by KeyWestPirate; 08-27-2021 at 10:11 AM.

  9. #209
    Pinolero De Cepa!! FisherCigarman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vaccine

    Quote Originally Posted by bill_bly_ca View Post
    We were trending up with a reproduction rate of 1.5 / 1.6 about a week ago

    this week that has dropped to 1.2 / 1.25

    Not below 1, which is what is required for infection rates as a whole to decrease.

    Some public health officials are worried that with the high vaccination rate those who are infected have such mild systems they do not seek testing which could result in a misleading metric.

    Less than a 1/4 of those in hospital are vaccinated.

    On the passport front - The premier (like a US Governor) is steadfast about not issuing vaccine passports unlike the next two most populous provinces. But Public health offices for specific regions do have the power to do so and are collaborating amongst themselves on a workable schema - Toronto public health being in the forefront..

    Surprisingly, or not so, it has not been too big of an issue in the national election - Surprisingly in that it is easy low hanging fruit (according t polls) an not so surprisingly in that public health is a provincial responsibility and federal parties pontificating on public health issues usually make problems with the provinces.
    that is a sad thing, many are infected with no symptoms and get vaccinated.
    one of my sisters in law in Esteli, took the shot, 3 days after hanging out with her infected daughter, bad thing is, my sister in law thou young,she's diabetic and has started to develop a bad case of dry cough , we are praying for her.
    We had been begging her to get vaccinated,since the Putnik got to Nic, to no avail , goes to show, everywhere in the world, folks don't take this Virus seriously until they fall gravely ill, some live to tell about it, some don't.
    The Entire north, it's a damn hot zone for covid right now in Esteli, and folks are beggining to drop like flies, specially those not vaccinated,and seems like those with only 1 shot, which are the vast majority, are getting gravely ill as well.

  10. #210
    Active TRN Member RGV AG's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vaccine

    This is a pretty lucid and "makes sense" article that has come out. I trust the Jews when it comes to research and stuff because they have "people" world wide and take their existence and survival very seriously. Sadly I do not think mankind is going to be totally effective at completely stopping this virus for decades until the natural immunity base is much stronger and bigger. Just my dumbass opinion.

    https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2021...ection-parties

  11. #211
    Pinolero De Cepa!! FisherCigarman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vaccine

    Quote Originally Posted by RGV AG View Post
    This is a pretty lucid and "makes sense" article that has come out. I trust the Jews when it comes to research and stuff because they have "people" world wide and take their existence and survival very seriously. Sadly I do not think mankind is going to be totally effective at completely stopping this virus for decades until the natural immunity base is much stronger and bigger. Just my dumbass opinion.

    https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2021...ection-parties
    I agree, thou I am not a conspiracy theorist suporter, infact, I despise them, but... I hate to admit,the big pharma has a money hand in the vaccines, ever since they started to push for a booster shot,but got sort of shutdown by CDC.
    eventually, there will be a medication/treatment over the counter to treat this virus like a severe cold,albeit 5+ years down the road,we shall see

  12. #212
    Viejo del Foro el duende grande's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vaccine

    Yeah, right now it looks like the vaccines are good for about 8 months and then start to go downhill. In the US the political class just doesn't get it. You need to push the vaccine on a voluntary basis, keep the protocols active "for the duration" depending on local conditions, and make changes to public health and labor laws. This isn't going to go away, the sooner we bite the bullet and make changes the better.

    Case in point: 2 restaurants in AZ I have been going to for 30 years. One is corporate and well designed from the beginning--wide aisles, etc. The only difference with covid is they put up sneeze guards, closed the waiting area, and added 2 benches outside. All they need to do is make this permanent is close 1 booth to have a bigger waiting area inside. The other is mom and pop. It was always crowded and I suspect never quite in line with existing occupancy limits and it has closet-like bathrooms. They have no sneeze guards and basically have done nothing during covid that I can see. State and local codes need to change to get every restaurant to up some reasonable standards.

    As far as Nic., it seems the last half of this year is going to be very bad. Playing catch up on vaccinations will take all year. Even CR has not come down from its spike, despite doing very well with vaccinations which will pay off--someday. And the political class is in denial--covid very much revolves around travel/tourism and public events.

    Yeah, Big Farma is going to make big bucks, but what can we do? Have CDC/NIH make a vaccine? Skip the vaccine and just tough it out to spite Big Pharma? Import everything from someplace smart like Taiwan?

    "Support mental health or I'll break your head"

    Covid was an intelligence test and we flunked.



  13. #213

    Default Re: Vaccine

    "Yeah, Big Farma is going to make big bucks, but what can we do? Have CDC/NIH make a vaccine? Skip the vaccine and just tough it out to spite Big Pharma? Import everything from someplace smart like Taiwan? "


    Perspective is incredibly important here.
    More and more they admit that immunity, and duration of immunity, is a significant multiple when antibodies are developed after an infection vs the vaccination. That's NOT what they were saying when I got COVID.
    In all fairness, they didn't know then.
    Now they know,, they just don't want you to know.

    Perspective. It's like this morning, I was talking to Gaylord about the deaths in Kabul.
    Going on about how these people were savages, and it would be just a short time before they start cutting off heads for effect.

    Gaylord looked up from his breakfast of RostiPollo scraps and ground corn soaked in chicken fat,, heated to his liking

    "Well, Muslims aren't ALL bad", he said.

    "Hows that ?"

    "Well,, Muslims don't eat pigs"
    With that he went back to his breakfast.

    He won that battle,, but I control the beer.

  14. #214
    Pinolero De Cepa!! FisherCigarman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vaccine

    Quote Originally Posted by KeyWestPirate View Post

    "Well,, Muslims don't eat pigs"
    With that he went back to his breakfast.

    He won that battle,, but I control the beer.

  15. #215
    Viejo del Foro el duende grande's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vaccine



    On average, Muslims are better than liberals.

    "Support mental health or I'll break your head"

    Covid was an intelligence test and we flunked.



  16. #216
    Pinolero De Cepa!! FisherCigarman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vaccine

    Quote Originally Posted by el duende grande View Post


    On average, Muslims are better than liberals.
    same or worse can be said about most republicans, I don't want to call them for what they truly are: Retrumplicans.
    Gone are the good olde Republicans,that cared for their people, now it's Me,Me,Me.

  17. #217
    Viejo del Foro Daddy-YO's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vaccine

    Some people, yes, even Canadians, are rather strongly anti-covid-vaccine.
    https://www.cnn.com/2021/09/23/ameri...rnd/index.html
    Of course, he's Québécois.

  18. #218
    TRN Science officer bill_bly_ca's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vaccine

    Quote Originally Posted by Daddy-YO View Post
    Some people, yes, even Canadians, are rather strongly anti-covid-vaccine.
    https://www.cnn.com/2021/09/23/ameri...rnd/index.html
    Of course, he's Québécois.
    Yes - Alberta and Saskatchewan are down for Vax rates - They are getting hammered now.

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  19. #219
    Viejo del Foro Daddy-YO's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vaccine

    Banned-by-YouTube. Here’s a very informative medical lecture by Dr. Ryan Cole about Covid video-taped in an Idaho courtroom. It’s from 6 months ago, yet still relevant. He talks 30 min’s, then the Q&A - less than 10 min - is also very worthwhile listening to.
    https://rumble.com/vf71zz-banned-by-...-experime.html

    This is anti-bully week at our kid’s school. It doesn’t refer to the presidential bullying to take the vaccine. So far Biden/Fauci aren’t bullying kids his age to get the jab. But many of their fascist followers want all of the unvaccinated fired or jailed immediately.

    See no evil, Hear no evil, Speak no evil: be a wise simian

  20. #220
    TRN Science officer bill_bly_ca's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vaccine

    Kids in Niclandia are getting the Cuban shot apparently.

    We , Canuckistan, is just a few regulatory steps away from getting the below 12 cohort vaccinated.

    Alberta and Saskatchewan are still getting hammered - Both because of a (relatively) low vaccination rate to the rest of the country but also populist provincial governments that opened the flood gates too seen (indoor masking reclined, venue limits, etc etc) Unfortunately it looks like we will loose another conservative government next fall (Alberta must call an election by next fall) as Premier Kenny is refusing help (well he did accept 8 army nurses, but that is all) and not entertaining additional lockdowns -

    Unlike the US, those actions are causing a precipitous fall in the polls as Cancer surgeries are being delayed, Heart attack patients are being flown out of province and hip, knee, and other elder care surgeries are punted far in the future. I mention elder as that is the base of conservatives in Alberta.

    It even hurt the conservative cause in our last election as Fuckle Chuck (Kenny) managed to stick to the national leader even as he (Kenny) stayed hidden and mouth shut for the 35 days.
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  21. #221
    TRN Science officer bill_bly_ca's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vaccine

    A recent article in the Lancet is being distilled down to the headline that unvaccinated people will be re-infected every (statistically) 16 months.

    Lancet
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  22. #222

    Default Re: Vaccine

    Quote Originally Posted by bill_bly_ca View Post
    A recent article in the Lancet is being distilled down to the headline that unvaccinated people will be re-infected every (statistically) 16 months.

    Lancet

    A purely speculative study not based on real world experience.

    I know a lot of people who were actually infected with the virus.
    The severity of the infection varied, as did the reported symptoms. It was clearly Covid.

    But, I have yet to meet anyone who was infected a second time.

    A large study (I remember some 5000 participants) of patients in Italy who were infected early on in the pandemic showed a very small re-infection rate.
    And some of these "re-infections" were just positive tests, not actual disease.
    That begs the question of how accurate the test was.



    https://www.npr.org/2021/08/01/10233...9-reinfections


    "GARCIA-NAVARRO: Can you just give me a sort of percentage? Do we know sort of what percentage of people have become reinfected?


    ADALJA: It's likely less than 1%, depending upon the numbers that you look at. It's not a very common thing - at least - and it will get higher as we get further out. But right now, it's probably less than 1%."

    Dr Adalja continues with a speculative sale of the vaccine:

    ADALJA: You're likely to be more protected than just having natural immunity. The data shows that people who have natural immunity - it's not nothing. It definitely is something that will likely protect you from the most severe consequences of a reinfection. But in general, the principle is that the immunity from natural infection is not as strong as what you get from a vaccine, and the vaccine will actually help you boost that immunity that you already have gained.


    Off topic, but still relevant to the discussion:
    I came across a comparison of the relative sizes of the virus and the openings in the weave of a mask.

    I cannot vouch for the accuracy,,
    but the poster claimed that a comparison in sizes would be similar to the openings in a chain link fence, and a mosquito.

  23. #223
    Viejo del Foro el duende grande's Avatar
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    Default Re: Vaccine

    old news from the anti-mask crowd, the virus particles are attached to larger moisture particles that are partially stopped by the masks. That's why your mask protects other people more than you. What I wonder is if the moisture particles are still intact when they hit an AC HEPA filter. Probably to a much lower degree.
    Masks are supposedly 40% effective. KN95 are theoretically 95% effective but less so in practice do to fit and operator error.

    Mexico lobbying for WHO to get with the program on Sputnik.
    https://mexiconewsdaily.com/news/cor...-agency-again/
    Last edited by el duende grande; 10-23-2021 at 09:37 AM.

    "Support mental health or I'll break your head"

    Covid was an intelligence test and we flunked.



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