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Thread: Bad Math?

  1. #1
    Dog Whisperer cookshow's Avatar
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    Default Bad Math?

    Yesterday I went out to pay light and internet, place next to the light sells papers and I usually buy one when I am in the area. La Prensa yesterday was pretty exciting, even with limited Spanish, still more translating to do. Researching one story I came across another about the increase in minimum wage.

    13% this year, don't quote me on this, something like part now and some later. I am all for everyone making more money, but it has to come from somewhere.

    This hypothetical situation came to mind:

    I own a hotel in Granada, have had it several years and have been unable to increase my rates in the past years because of increased competition. Prices for the basics have tripled in recent years. I have 4 employees. Now I am faced with having to incease my labor costs by 13%. Easy solution fire 1 employee, make the others pick up the slack. Sounds heartless but it's me or them and none of them signed the check to buy the place.

    Increase in minimum wage equals increase in unemployment?

    I am just posing the question, I can't afford 1 employee, no one here would lift a finger for the minimum wage even if it raised 50%. Minimum wage for agriculture will raise to a little over $100 month. My last workmen made double that and worked far less than the 48 hours a week figured for the minimum wage.
    ‎"You know what you say when people tell you you can't do something? Fool, shut your mouth up!"
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  2. #2
    Para aquí para acá Jonh's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bad Math?

    It depends whether your employees get minimum wage or not. If you already pay them 13% more than min. wage, you don't have to give them a raise I suppose.

    Up here, union contracts are tied to the minimum wage so if the min. wage goes up, so do union member salaries even though they make way more than that.

  3. #3
    Dog Whisperer cookshow's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bad Math?

    Well I guess that is part of what I getting at, ask some of those Union folks around Detroit how the increasing wages worked out.

    Everyone deserves fair compensation, but it has to come from somewhere.
    ‎"You know what you say when people tell you you can't do something? Fool, shut your mouth up!"
    Ernie K Doe

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    Former SJDS Bureau Chief, TRN Danpolley's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bad Math?

    Quote Originally Posted by cookshow View Post
    Well I guess that is part of what I getting at, ask some of those Union folks around Detroit how the increasing wages worked out.

    Everyone deserves fair compensation, but it has to come from somewhere.
    In the long run any system only works if both parties, workers and owners are taken care of. If either get their way with extreme greed, both loose. Why do you think some folks study history?
    Sometimes I think I understand everything, then I regain consciousness.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Bad Math?

    In the long run any system only works if both parties, workers and owners are taken care of. If either get their way with extreme greed, both loose. Why do you think some folks study history?*

    So true. The big problem with these relatively large increases is that they are being given to make up for the high inflation of these countries. With relatively low inflation of 2% or so an increase doesn't hurt that much as business's can raise prices slowly without a huge impact. When you have 20% or 25% or 30% inflation it is very difficult to keep up and it just feeds upon itself. i.e) if i own a business i am going to raise my prices higher than the expected inflation on a monthly basis ahead of time to keep ahead of the curve. what happens? surprise! more inflation. It is a vicious cycle and it is why serious governments take inflation very seriously. Doesn't work with populist governments who are not serious about anything but staying in power. Very simplistic but my opinion.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Bad Math?

    I wonder if the conquistador mentality is simply part of the human condition. The conquistadors wanted to own all the land and resources and have the Indians work for them for nothing. I see plenty of gringos and even nicas doing that today.

    I recently met a couple who live in Panama now, after 30 years of working blue collar union jobs in Windsor, ON. They speak no Spanish and are not trying to learn. They have a house keeper who they claim to treat very kindly, but pay virtually nothing.

    A friend of mine is a diehard Sandanista who studied Marxist economics in Cuba in the 80's. He inherited a few ranches through his wife. No he is an absentee landlord with a solidly middle class income. His workers make $150/mo plus room and board. I heard teachers make $100/mo and no room and board. Staggering.

  7. #7

    Default Re: Bad Math?

    Increase in minimum wage equals increase in unemployment?
    Unemployment. Hmmm. I am reminded that the entire industrial revolution has been about labor saving devices. Almost every futurologist from of the past 200 years, from Marx to Nixon, have promised us release from drudgery and more leisure time... But, that is not what happens.

    If we were able to keep labor in the same place where we saved it, maybe a future of leisure could exist. Instead the state and the banking system conspire to force people out of rural areas (where food and roofs are cheap) and into the city where they must hustle to make money in order to eat and keep a roof over their heads.

    This is not new, and not limited even to the industrial age. The Egyptians were so productive they could afford to be idle. But the Pharaoh thought it better they should all work.

    There are no shoe shine boys in the USA because shoe shines are not valuable enough to justify labor. Even when unemployment hit 10% nobody moved back into the vacant niche of shining shoes. When they do (and I bet we will see this in a few years) it will be because their only alternative is homelessness and hunger. In a land, the USA, where productive land is overpriced, underutilized, and controlled by a fascist banking system.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Bad Math?

    It is human nature. It changes throughout the years, but always is the same. Same shit, different pile. A good example today is Cuba. There is not a single person on that Island who isn't practicing capitalism in some form or another. Everyone has a side deal going on. If they don't they don't survive. The irony is that is that the Castro's are practicing their own form of colonialism. The populace needs a beneficial leader to dole out what he determines the populace needs. It is so bloody pathetic. Now, I hate talking politics, but instead of basing their governments on Marx etc., why not try the social democratic forms such as Sweden? I am not saying that is the way to go, i have different ideas, but why base there system on a failed ideology? Umm, because they just want to have power and rule forever maybe? And so called intellectuals back these guys like Chavez and Castro and gadaffi up. It is just mind boggling to me. As Churchill said, democracy is bad, but the alternatives are worse. (and someone can correct me on this quote, it is from memory)

  9. #9
    Viejo del Foro Just Plain John Wayne's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bad Math?

    Pretty simple to me, if I cannot make a certain profit from my work and investment.

    I'm gone do something else with my time and effort, sometimes you win sometimes you lose your ass.

    Like Cookshow told me years ago over a cold beer.

    John I got to the point I looked at the bottom line in my business and saw I was the one working for my employees. Now he is a Sharecropper on
    Corn Island and has no stress on his butt.
    To be called a "Has Been" I must surmise, is much Greater than to be called a "Nevah Been"... JW...



  10. #10
    TRN's fiesty redhead catahoula fan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bad Math?

    Now he is a Sharecropper on Corn Island and has no stress on his butt.
    He has "tomato stress" all over his butt!
    "Patience is a virtue, but persistence to the point of success is a blessing."

  11. #11

    Default Re: Bad Math?

    I think i asked this question before, but can someone explain how, when i reply to a post, it disappears, and other times not? mostly it does. Is it that the post disappears for me until someone replies? Thanks in advance. that is if I can find this post again.

  12. #12
    Viejo del Foro Just Plain John Wayne's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bad Math?

    He is just going to have to learn to cut back on the intake of them and just buy 'em little bags of NATURES tomato paste and adapt his recipes.

    Till he gets the right formula for it.
    To be called a "Has Been" I must surmise, is much Greater than to be called a "Nevah Been"... JW...



  13. #13
    Viejo del Foro Just Plain John Wayne's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bad Math?

    Quote Originally Posted by pickled toe View Post
    I think i asked this question before, but can someone explain how, when i reply to a post, it disappears, and other times not? mostly it does. Is it that the post disappears for me until someone replies? Thanks in advance. that is if I can find this post again.
    Yes once I post on the thread it dissappers till someone brings it back up or you look where it says all posts in the last 24 hours
    To be called a "Has Been" I must surmise, is much Greater than to be called a "Nevah Been"... JW...



  14. #14

    Default Re: Bad Math?

    Thank you John Wayne. Do you remember John Wayne's yellow handled pistol. Did he not have the same pistol in every western he was in?

  15. #15
    Viejo del Foro Just Plain John Wayne's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bad Math?

    And when in the movies he made when he took a shot of whiskey it was the real thing.

    Hell of a man but he made it where there are only a few places I can use my real name.
    To be called a "Has Been" I must surmise, is much Greater than to be called a "Nevah Been"... JW...



  16. #16

    Default Re: Bad Math?

    my guess is it was the real thing - if it wasn't I would be disillusioned.

  17. #17

    Default Re: Bad Math?

    Quote Originally Posted by pickled toe View Post
    It is human nature. It changes throughout the years, but always is the same. Same shit, different pile. A good example today is Cuba. There is not a single person on that Island who isn't practicing capitalism in some form or another. Everyone has a side deal going on. If they don't they don't survive. The irony is that is that the Castro's are practicing their own form of colonialism. The populace needs a beneficial leader to dole out what he determines the populace needs. It is so bloody pathetic. Now, I hate talking politics, but instead of basing their governments on Marx etc., why not try the social democratic forms such as Sweden? I am not saying that is the way to go, i have different ideas, but why base there system on a failed ideology? Umm, because they just want to have power and rule forever maybe? And so called intellectuals back these guys like Chavez and Castro and gadaffi up. It is just mind boggling to me. As Churchill said, democracy is bad, but the alternatives are worse. (and someone can correct me on this quote, it is from memory)
    " Democracy is certainly the worst form of government- except for all the others." Smart guy, that Winston.

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