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Thread: Cathedral Panoramic

  1. #1

    Default Cathedral Panoramic

    I visited Leon on Monday the 13th of February to look for a room. I had a nice place lined up in the outskirts of Chinandega called Grecsa. It was on the high end for me (that's $130/month), but it is a new place and has nice furnishing and is safe and in a quiet area. It didn't have internet yet. She told me that they'd have it installed in 10 days, but this being Nicaragua, I knew that I may never get the internet, and I had to factor that into my decision. Ultimately, I decided that I could live without the internet if I had to, and I let her know that I'd take it. She then told me that there's a $130 deposit in addition to the first month's rent. I don't do deposits (I had a bad experience), so I asked her if she would make an exception--and she said no. Anyway, this is why come Monday I was kicking around Leon looking for a room.

    I found a place that had everything that I wanted/needed for $100, and then I decided to walk around the town to reminisce. After I'd walked down to the Sutiava market and back, I stopped by the Cathedral and the central park. I saw the people up top that I saw the last time I was in Leon, but this time I thought, "What the hell," and I paid the C$86 to go up there to take some pictures.

    It's beautiful up there; I won't deny that. The experience was somewhat fouled by the presence of wave upon wave of tourist group. I'm not talking about the Europeans that travel in pairs or in trios. I'm talking about dozens of older people being buses in or dozens on boys that looked about 12 or 13. I have never seen so many tourists anywhere in all of Central America (including Costa Rica) ever. I don't know if Leon has a busy season or if this was a fluke or what.

    I've included my favorite shots from on top of the Cathedral for any of you who might not want to pay the C$86 or climb the stairs or visit Leon...

    Enjoy!

    Soy el chele mono.

  2. #2

    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    more photos:

    Soy el chele mono.

  3. #3
    House SOB Little Corn Tom's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    Nice Pics.... So clean and beautiful.....

    Are you sure this is Nicaragua?....lol?
    Life's different here ... It's a whole 'nother pace.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    And the last of the photos:

    Soy el chele mono.

  5. #5

    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    Quote Originally Posted by Little Corn Tom View Post
    Nice Pics.... So clean and beautiful.....

    Are you sure this is Nicaragua?....lol?
    I had to take my shoes off to walk around the roof, and I was a layer of dirt on my soles when I was done, so looks can be deceiving. Also, while is is relatively clean up top, Leon has it's share of garbage piled on the sides of the streets and dead rats in the street and other wonderfully dirty and grounding elements found in Nicaraguan towns.
    Soy el chele mono.

  6. #6
    Para aquí para acá Jonh's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    Great views, especially with the distant mountains.

  7. #7
    Viejo del Foro el duende grande's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    Is there any parking near the Cat? We passed by there yesterday returning from Las Penitas thinking we could show the grand kids the Parque central. Since last visit it seems they have blocked off the streets around the park and created a traffic disaster on the surrounding streets so we skipped it. Anyone know where there is parking within walking distance?

    "Support mental health or I'll break your head"


  8. #8

    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    The last time that I was there in a vehicle (with KWP), we had to park 4 blocks away and walk. You may be able to find something closer depending on when you're there, but you will have to walk at least a little.
    Soy el chele mono.

  9. #9
    House SOB Little Corn Tom's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    Do you have any interior shots?
    Life's different here ... It's a whole 'nother pace.

  10. #10

    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    Quote Originally Posted by Little Corn Tom View Post
    Do you have any interior shots?
    I don't have any right now, but since I'm only three blocks away, I can hook you up. Pictures pending...
    Soy el chele mono.

  11. #11
    Viejo del Foro Daddy-YO's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    Quote Originally Posted by drlemcor View Post
    ... I stopped by the Cathedral .... I saw the people up top ... I thought, "What the hell," and I paid the C$86 to go up there to take some pictures.
    I had to laugh at that thought.

    I understand that your reaction was not a blanket condemnation of the Church's architectural attempt to create heaven on Earth, but rather the gut shock of having to pay 86 cords (almost 3 bucks) to traipse on the roof.

    For 3 of the past 4 years they've been sandblasting & whitewashing the Cathedral with curtained scaffolding, so you & gaggles of tourists could enjoy the result. It had been covered with plenty of (holy?) black mold.

    The green roofed building along side is Colegio San Ramon, 330+ years old. Our (OK, her) daughter graduated from there. It was the site of the original university UNAN.

    With the seasonal winds, dry climate and peanut harvesting turning up the soil, volcanic dust is in the air, in our lungs & eyes, and it got on your shoeless feet. You can write a message in a days worth of dust. If you've ever wondered how ancient ruins get buried 10-20 feet underground - here you can feel it.
    I never met a Semite I didn't like.

  12. #12
    House SOB Little Corn Tom's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    Quote Originally Posted by drlemcor View Post
    I don't have any right now, but since I'm only three blocks away, I can hook you up. Pictures pending...

    That would be great.....tnx
    Life's different here ... It's a whole 'nother pace.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    I took these this afternoon. They are repairing the inside of the cathedral. I managed to keep the scaffolding and ladders out of most of the pictures to give you a feel for what it looks like most of the time:

    Soy el chele mono.

  14. #14
    House SOB Little Corn Tom's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    Just beautiful....very impressive.

    I wonder when it was built?
    Life's different here ... It's a whole 'nother pace.

  15. #15

    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    Great pics, very opulent.

  16. #16

    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    Yes,, really nice. Was looking for an excuse to go back to Leon.

  17. #17
    House SOB Little Corn Tom's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    Quote Originally Posted by Little Corn Tom View Post
    Just beautiful....very impressive.

    I wonder when it was built?

    Never answered my own question before....

    The Cathedral of León, also known as Our Lady of Grace Cathedral and the "Real and Renowned Basilica Cathedral of the Assumption of the Blessed Virgin Mary", is a significantly important and historic landmark in Nicaragua. Wikipedia


    Address: Av Central, León, Nicaragua


    Opened: 1814


    Groundbreaking: 1747


    Phone: +505 2311 4820


    Architectural style: Neoclassical architecture


    Province: Roman Catholic Diocese of León in Nicaragua



    Took 63 years to build and I wonder how many Inditos were killed building it? How was it funded?
    Life's different here ... It's a whole 'nother pace.

  18. #18

    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    Quote Originally Posted by Little Corn Tom View Post
    Took 63 years to build and I wonder how many Inditos were killed building it? How was it funded?
    I don't know, but I suspect that the history of the region suggests an answer.

    Leon Viejo was abandoned (because of a volcanic eruption I think...but maybe a war...it's been too long since I've been down there and asked), and the people who used to live in Leon Viejo migrated to a neighbor community that had been there for a very long time (pre-colonization) called Sutiava. The Subtiavans took in the Leon Viejo refugees on the east side of their city. The wealthier and more Spanish influenced residents of New Leon quickly transitioned to become the aristocracy of the Sutiavans.

    My guess is that the Leon Viejo migrants used their wealth and class structure to yoke their more "indio" neighbors (the Sutiavans) to build to new "historic center" of Leon including the massive cathedral. I put this last in quotes, because Sutiava is much much older and more historic than the impressive current center of Leon. It's through a rewrite of history from the victors (or dominant culture) that the city is known as Leon instead of Sutiava.

    In all likelihood, many Sutiavans were worked under slavish conditions (even if they didn't die as a result) in order to create the current center of Leon.

    Be careful who who you welcome into your home, eh?
    Last edited by drlemcor; 02-24-2017 at 09:44 AM. Reason: spelling
    Soy el chele mono.

  19. #19
    House SOB Little Corn Tom's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    Quote Originally Posted by drlemcor View Post
    I don't know, but I suspect that the history of the region suggests an answer.

    Leon Viejo was abandoned (because of a volcanic eruption I think...but maybe a war...it's been too long since I've been down there and asked), and the people who used to live in Leon Viejo migrated to a neighbor community that had been there for a very long time (pre-colonization) called Sutiava. The Subtiavans took in the Leon Viejo refugees on the east side of their city. The wealthier and more Spanish influenced residents of New Leon quickly transitioned to become the aristocracy of the Sutiavans.

    My guess is that the Leon Viejo migrants used their wealth and class structure to yoke their more "idio" neighbors (the Sutiavans) to build to new "historic center" of Leon including the massive cathedral. I put this last in quotes, because Sutiava is much much older and more historic than the impressive current center of Leon. It's through a rewrite of history from the victors (or dominant culture) that the city is known as Leon instead of Sutiava.

    In all likelihood, many Sutiavans were worked under slavish conditions (even if they didn't die as a result) in order to create the current center of Leon.

    Be careful who you welcome into your home, eh?
    Isn't that what Trump has been saying?
    Life's different here ... It's a whole 'nother pace.

  20. #20

    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    Quote Originally Posted by Little Corn Tom View Post
    Isn't that what Trump has been saying?
    I'm no Trump expert, but I think that Trump is more focused what individuals might do (criminals/terrorist) rather than the long term influence of predatory culture.
    Soy el chele mono.

  21. #21
    Para aquí para acá Jonh's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    Hopefully it's both.

  22. #22
    Viejo del Foro Daddy-YO's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    Quote Originally Posted by drlemcor View Post
    . . . the long term influence of predatory culture.
    I don't see Latins in the US today as a "predatory culture". Their values - family, religion, tradition (to name a few) - are a hundred years out of sync with those of most gringos, who tend to think more in terms of career. The disruption cause by their growing presence affects our sense of progress, esp. re. the welfare - work roles and our social conscience of security for all living here.

    And as far as the Spaniards in the New World, that was simply an outright military conquest. Had they brought their women (la gigantona) looking for good maids or somesuch, I could see it as "cultural depredation". The indigenous peoples were viewed as ignorant, godless savages (as was the case up North, a couple hundred years later). Most of the men were killed or enslaved by the conquistadors. Their foot-soldiers took the women as wives. (Up North most of the indigenous were exterminated.) There is far more native DNA in Latino populations than of people in the USA & Canada.
    I never met a Semite I didn't like.

  23. #23

    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    Quote Originally Posted by Daddy-YO View Post
    I don't see Latins in the US today as a "predatory culture".
    Nor do I. As I understand the history of Leon and Sutiava, this was some time after the military conquest, so what it would have looked like were those who had been more influenced by Spanish culture (Leon Viejo) versus those who hadn't (Sutiava). Thus, it was one city-state culture of Nicaraguans feeding on another city-state culture of Nicaraguans.
    Last edited by drlemcor; 02-24-2017 at 02:50 PM. Reason: grammar
    Soy el chele mono.

  24. #24
    Para aquí para acá Jonh's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    Lots of Latino gangs, and drug cartels.

    Ask Sweden and Germany about predatory foreign cultures coming in...

  25. #25
    Viejo del Foro Daddy-YO's Avatar
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    Default Re: Cathedral Panoramic

    Leon viejo thrived for some 70+ yrs because that was where the gold ore shipped across the lake from the northern mountains was refined, and carefully controlled before sending it on to Panama and then to the crown in Spain. The Spaniards were mostly an occupying military force. The Church brought 'culture'. Many centers of native populations, such as Sutiava, continued life as they had, but without native political leaders, and esp. without armed warriors. When a couple leaders arose in Sutiava after 200 yrs of subjugation, they were hung. (That tree is a tourist site.)

    Within any country many cultures can coexist, and, clearly, they can merge and evolve. Today the dominant culture tends to have a nationalistic identity. But back then those could hardly have been considered "city-states", esp. Sutiava. In its early days as an independent nation, Nicaragua did have two city-states - Leon & Granada - that fought for political dominance of the country.

    For centuries after the conquest, the native Indians were no more than a source of peons for land-holding patrons.
    I never met a Semite I didn't like.

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