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Thread: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

  1. #76
    Dog Whisperer cookshow's Avatar
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    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    I had forgot about it, never any follow up. Not strange here.
    ‎"You know what you say when people tell you you can't do something? Fool, shut your mouth up!"
    Ernie K Doe

  2. #77
    The Bard of Jinotega MizBrown's Avatar
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    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    Quote Originally Posted by cookshow View Post
    Maybe someone will remember, can find. That Guy's Wife posted here or NL that she had got word her Husband was sick (Dead was what he was), always thought it was odd she knew soon as it happened.

    I read it the year or so that I came here. It was on NL and the husband had disappeared and she was trying to find him. The assholes on NL were having a go at her for trying to interrupt his fun with his new bonk. Then someone told her that he'd been killed. One of the guys who'd been having a go at her apologized. One of the nastier ones didn't. She was advised not to come down to Nicaragua because it was dangerous.

  3. #78
    Viejo del Foro Daddy-YO's Avatar
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    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    From Ken’s widow Marty posted on NL 1 June, 2007 - 00:58.

    Ken Kinzel was a Quaker for many years. Nonviolence was his credo. why did he have a gun? All his friends know this. He spent many years volunteering and working for peace and justice. He loved Nicaragua and its people, and wanted to live a simple life in solidarity. He had been a loyal and devoted husband up until this time. His wife was still working in the States, but was to join him at their farm in Miraflor. This left him alone for extended times and vulnerable.

    This woman was brought to him and introduced as a Spanish tutor on December 2nd, 2006, as a 21-yr old college student with the last name Teycker. She brought her 2-yr old with her, and allowed the baby to suckle at her breast in front of Kinzel. He began to believe he had missed something by never having a child of his own. He was very distraught over the developing situation, because he loved his wife as well. He tried to break off the relationship several times. But she kept coming back. She did whatever it took to keep him in her clutches. Once he was told she was pregnant, he wanted to take full responsibility for her and the child. She told him she wanted an abortion, which left him very distraught, but something made her change her mind. He was very concerned with having her eat a healthy diet, so that she would have a healthy baby. He cooked, he did the dishes, he waited on her.

    She insisted on the residence in town where she would have access to him, without others interfering (his apt. was in a family compound). She pushed him to divorce his wife. She pushed him for money. Numerous friends knew he was being set-up and used from the start. The girl (and her friends) capitalized on his vulnerability. Physically, she is a large and strong, likely as strong as Kinzel, not the delicate pregnant girl she has been painted to be.

    Ken Kinzel was a naive and gullible Gringo, who could minimally speak the language. This was not the first Gringo for this girl. The more likely scenario is that Kinzel was physically abused by the girl (he was seen with a black eye several weeks prior). Has anybody ever seen her with bruises? Her family lived closeby. She could easily leave if she did not want to be there. Maybe he thought he could tame this sociopath with his non-violent philosophy. But he didn't do it fast enough.

    Ultimately, he was manipulated, used, bilked of his readily available assets, then shot and mercilessly slaughtered, whereupon the girl quickly proceeded to try and liquidate his remaining possessions.

    Get the facts. Then speak in the cause of justice. thank you, Marty Jo Johnson, Ken's widow.
    I never met a Semite I didn't like.

  4. #79
    Viejo del Foro el duende grande's Avatar
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    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    The more I experience life, the less I like Peace, social justice, etc. They think they have the moral high ground, but they can be just greedy egoists fighting for power.
    No contradiction between nonviolence and owning a gun. In fact, non-violence as a tactic is often the best option and doesn't have the moral turpitude of pacifism.

    I'm nonviolent, but attack me or mine and I will do my best to triple tap you in a heartbeat. No contradiction in my mind.

    "Support mental health or I'll break your head"


  5. #80
    Viejo del Foro Daddy-YO's Avatar
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    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    The gun was owned by Kiutza Hidalgo's father. She said that he sold it to Ken. It was never found.

    The Quaker woman was simply defending her dead husband. Non-violence means something different to Quakers.
    I never met a Semite I didn't like.

  6. #81
    Dog Whisperer cookshow's Avatar
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    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    Quakers like non violence but is ok to cheat on their wives, great Religion.
    ‎"You know what you say when people tell you you can't do something? Fool, shut your mouth up!"
    Ernie K Doe

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    House SOB Little Corn Tom's Avatar
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    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    Quote Originally Posted by cookshow View Post
    Quakers like non violence but is ok to cheat on their wives, great Religion.

    Name a great one.
    Life's different here ... It's a whole 'nother pace.

  8. #83
    Viejo del Foro el duende grande's Avatar
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    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    Quakers tend to be pacifists. Non-violence is a more pragmatic thing, more a tactic than a core philosophy. Quackers can be cured, remember that great old flic Sargent York?
    Ever here how Quaker is pronounced in Spanish

    Men are pigs, sometimes some of us channel it in healthy directions. Hard to bat 1000. Wives who let their husbands live apart in NIc. are probably showing a lack of wisdom,
    Like the great Al Bundy said "Why go out for milk when you have a cow at home?".

    "Support mental health or I'll break your head"


  9. #84
    Para aquí para acá Jonh's Avatar
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    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    3 beans isn't named Berman, must be a different guy.

  10. #85
    The Bard of Jinotega MizBrown's Avatar
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    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    Quote Originally Posted by Daddy-YO View Post
    From Ken’s widow Marty posted on NL 1 June, 2007 - 00:58.

    Ken Kinzel was a naive and gullible Gringo, who could minimally speak the language. This was not the first Gringo for this girl. The more likely scenario is that Kinzel was physically abused by the girl (he was seen with a black eye several weeks prior). Has anybody ever seen her with bruises? Her family lived closeby. She could easily leave if she did not want to be there. Maybe he thought he could tame this sociopath with his non-violent philosophy. But he didn't do it fast enough.

    Ultimately, he was manipulated, used, bilked of his readily available assets, then shot and mercilessly slaughtered, whereupon the girl quickly proceeded to try and liquidate his remaining possessions.

    Get the facts. Then speak in the cause of justice. thank you, Marty Jo Johnson, Ken's widow.

    The guy who told me about how much very poor people resent having any gains taken away didn't learn that from hanging out with women, but from starting to feed kids breakfast. He ended up with 20 a morning. He stopped. They were pissed and one of them knocked over his motorcycle. Kinzel was a male who had to be interested sexually to be able to get an erection (I understand that guys can be scared into erections, but that doesn't seem to have been the case here.

    I also think that if a person is determined to make a relationship mistake, no amount of judicious advice will persuade him that he/her should really get out now. A gringa here was robbed multiple times by her younger Nicaraguan lover. One would think that once would be sobering enough, but apparently not.

    Moral of this store is that there was no moral of this story. Guy was cheating on his wife to start which tends to lead to further decisions that are less clear-sighted.

    Heard from someone who'd been married to a cop who worked on the case or was one of the prison cops that the girl had some seriously mental problems.

  11. #86

    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    You may have noticed that I am a little obcessed with pigs at the moment,, but I'll get over the phase and return to something else eventually.

    I fed a crippled chicken to the pigs (other pigs) today,, sow stepped on it. Talk about blood lust. I'm dying to try a dog but after we started putting all our trash in a chain link enclosure they just don't come around like they used to.

    I may have a recessive Hanibal Lector gene surfacing.

  12. #87
    Para aquí para acá Jonh's Avatar
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    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)


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    Viejo del Foro el duende grande's Avatar
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    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    If you have a Nica family you have to adjust to the pecking order. I soon learned to not give things to people unless it was genuinely surplus, with the exception of one neighbor family with whom we have a lot of dealings. Even then, I usually have my wife do the giving. Some of it is the older daughter thing, she has to be in charge, and some of it is the desire to not look like the overly generous foreigner. And last, but not certainly least, watch out for giving things to "muchachas", even if it is innocent. Let the ole lady do the giving to keep her and everyone else on their best behavior.

    Every trip eventually becomes a mini chopping trip, especially for the grandkids and the niece's daughter. This year it is shoes, which they frequently grow out of. Pacas work, but if you are in the US or Panama you might as well splurge and give them something new.

    I've added a new one to the list, "la nina". I had noticed a girl of about 7 years of age at our house parties and eventually got curious and asked who she was. She always stood out a little because she was generally more behaved than the family kids, but a little standoffish. Seems she is the daughter of one of the inlaw's maid, who ran away and left the kid. Further inquiry found she actually had a name and I showed my wife how to pronounce it and I make a reasonable effort to call her by name when she is around. I make sure she is included in activities like our recent beach trip. The inlaw had offered to adopt her, but the mother living in the countryside declined. She has no birth certificate, The mother does know the date of birth but won't disclose it.

    Sort of ironic that she now lives with the niece who was also abandoned as a baby, her parents running in opposite directions and leaving her to be raised by grandma. She was just barely in touch with her mother while growing up, but it was 20 plus years before mom came for a visit. and so it goes...

    "Support mental health or I'll break your head"


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    Dog Whisperer cookshow's Avatar
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    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    Quote Originally Posted by Jonh View Post
    3 beans isn't named Berman, must be a different guy.
    is Berman the Moon guide co author Was Peace Corps
    Last edited by cookshow; 04-05-2017 at 04:28 PM.
    ‎"You know what you say when people tell you you can't do something? Fool, shut your mouth up!"
    Ernie K Doe

  15. #90

    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    Getting back to the girls,, especially in the north,, but I suspect still everywhere in Nicaragua:

    Girls are supposed to be back home at night and spend the night within the house. Clearly,, this doesn't necessary prevent the inevitable, but it it goes a long way towards avoiding it.

    Girls are expected to be virgins on their "wedding" night. The wedding might be as simple as a handshake and promise,, but this expectation carries serious weight,, and serious consequences.

    Clearly,, there is a lot of burla here by smooth talking, well -dressed young chevalos on motorcycles, with promises of marriage. But, if the girl gets pregnant and the guy disappears it's huge pena for the family (and her),, and avoiding this possibility is drummed into their heads from an early age.


    Now there are various possibilities: you might meet a girl who's parents work in CR. I have a friend in that situation. The girl can spend the night with him,, but when the parents return,, she has to return to the family house. They still have their afternoons after she gets off work,, but back home for the night.

    The virginity thing is not important to her as she has decided that her future is in the US. She is very young, attractive, university student, and realizes that if Gringo #1 doesn't pan out,, Gringo #2 probably will. The couple enjoy each other's company,, I've never seen them argue,, she still works and goes to school,, but he helps in ways that make it a lot easier.

    The culture is complicated. To really get serious is a long term business,, unless you are just looking for a Managua bar girl. To find a friend,, and perhaps eventually a wife,, is not easy here.

  16. #91

    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    Quote Originally Posted by KeyWestPirate View Post
    The culture is complicated. To really get serious is a long term business,, unless you are just looking for a Managua bar girl. To find a friend,, and perhaps eventually a wife,, is not easy here.
    Asi es.
    Soy el chele mono.

  17. #92
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    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    This thread is the greatest waste of human intelligence since the inventions of the game of chess and public relations.

  18. #93

    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    Quote Originally Posted by Mikeh View Post
    This thread is the greatest waste of human intelligence since the inventions of the game of chess and public relations.
    I don't know about most--but for me the tone of this thread has more to do with emotional conciliation than it does with expanding intellect. That being said, there are many personal cautionary stories shared on this thread. To those who might some day find themselves in similar circumstances, these stories could help them to avoid the same pitfalls.

    I'll agree that remembering our woes and spending time wallowing in those memories has a self indulgent or masturbatory air that does little to elevate or enlighten those who have already gone through those experiences, and to that degree I can see a corollary with chess and PR.
    Soy el chele mono.

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    Viejo del Foro el duende grande's Avatar
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    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    Well. I don't play chess. Like fishing, it is just too much work! But I always heard that chess stimulates one's brain and teaches strategy. Public relations is no worse than advertising or the evening news or International Living.

    This post is some of the experience of people who have lived here a while and is a great counterbalance to the usual "I have lived here 3 weeks and everyone is so wonderful" posts you get on most websites.

    "Support mental health or I'll break your head"


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    House SOB Little Corn Tom's Avatar
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    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    Quote Originally Posted by el duende grande View Post

    This post is some of the experience of people who have lived here a while and is a great counterbalance to the usual "I have lived here 3 weeks and everyone is so wonderful" posts you get on most websites.
    Hence, the name "The Real Nicaragua".
    Life's different here ... It's a whole 'nother pace.

  21. #96
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    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    Quote Originally Posted by Mikeh View Post
    This thread is the greatest waste of human intelligence since the inventions of the game of chess and public relations.

    Mike Tell us what you really think .....
    ==================================================
    Dude !!!.... Its a Canal !!! Can you Dig it ??

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    The Bard of Jinotega MizBrown's Avatar
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    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    Quote Originally Posted by Mikeh View Post
    This thread is the greatest waste of human intelligence since the inventions of the game of chess and public relations.
    You troll, you, and real estate hustler, you. Pity you had nothing intelligent to add.

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    The Bard of Jinotega MizBrown's Avatar
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    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    Quote Originally Posted by el duende grande View Post
    Well. I don't play chess. Like fishing, it is just too much work! But I always heard that chess stimulates one's brain and teaches strategy. Public relations is no worse than advertising or the evening news or International Living.

    This post is some of the experience of people who have lived here a while and is a great counterbalance to the usual "I have lived here 3 weeks and everyone is so wonderful" posts you get on most websites.
    Mikeh sells real estate and so needs the happy testimony of people who are still in the honeymoon glow (apparently most marriages between the expats and the Nicas of any combination of orientations are in the first year or two). The women who find foreign guys impossible also get disillusioned, per conversation with my Spanish teacher. The smaller the experience with other cultures, the stronger people believe that their culture is the right one and the unexamined arbitrary ways of doing things are human nature.

    I've been down here so long, when I went to Mexico City, it didn't seem that foreign and people understood my Spanish. The best advice anyone gave me when I was first here was "Be a chameleon," and I look Nicaraguan to the gringo tourists, not sure about the Nicaraguans because everyone in town seems to know who I am.

  24. #99
    TRN Science officer bill_bly_ca's Avatar
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    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    Quote Originally Posted by cookshow View Post
    is Berman the Moon guide co author Was Peace Corps
    Berman sells Rainbows, lollipops and the occasional plot of land in SJDS. Now not on the scale of International living, but he is definitely on the "Next Costa rica" bandwaggon.
    ==================================================
    Dude !!!.... Its a Canal !!! Can you Dig it ??

  25. #100
    The Bard of Jinotega MizBrown's Avatar
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    Default Re: Save El Porton Verde (and my son!)

    Quote Originally Posted by bill_bly_ca View Post
    Berman sells Rainbows, lollipops and the occasional plot of land in SJDS. Now not on the scale of International living, but he is definitely on the "Next Costa rica" bandwaggon.
    I think there are two different SJdS Bermans -- one of them is in real estate and owns a bar. Is he also the same Berman of the guides?

    San Juan del Sur is turning into the "Next Costa Rica" in the worst possible ways -- more crime, more insane real estate prices, more drunken and drugged up tourists (don't know if anyone is offering some of the really toxic South American indigenous preparations yet (yage, etc.), but they've already got the fake shamans and such. The scene there seems to have less and less to do with being in Nicaragua and more and more to be portable US bohemia with some concessions to diversity.

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